beebware

I wouldn't class this as 'abuse', but just human error. In this case, I would just contact either an editor 'four levels up', or one of the 'editalls' listed on http://dmoz.org/edoc/editall.html who will be able to go in and correct the mistake(s). We do have a 'crack team' of editalls etc that maintain a list of common spelling mistakes which are scanned for and corrected on an 'ad hoc' basis. >> ...least, we may be working together. << You could be working with any and all editors <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" /> No editor should mind _constructive_ criticism, so feel free to contact any editor - don't worry about them possibly being your 'mentor' in the future: I know if I see a mistake by a senior editor, I sometimes point it out to them - likewise when others spot that I have made a very very rare mistake <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" /> >> Or are such observations from non-editors generally unwelcome? << Nope, they are more than welcome. We've got over 3.8million listings in ODP, and there are bound to be a few mistakes. Sometimes it's just a case of a slight typo, regionalisation issues (i.e. the UK/US/Other English spelling differences), changes in the 'structure' of ODP (causing similar sites to be in different categories) or something malicious. We, obviously, can't double and treble re-check every single edit, so if you see a mistake: feel free to let us know! >> Would the correct procedure in this case be to find a Meta editing in the area above and contact them via e-mail? << Feel free to contact any 'higher up' editor, it doesn't have to be a Meta. Remember if an editor edits Arts/ they can also correct mistakes in Arts/Literature but not necessarily Regional/ (unless they are a 'meta' editor or an 'editall such as myself). Hope this helps, and feel free to contact myself with a list of mistakes you've spotted if you want. Alink to my ODP editor profile should be in my 'signature' here, or click on my name on the left hand side and send me a private message.

But, remember, if you do decide to submit to your 'locality' (ie where you are physically based) ensure we've got some way of checking. If you haven't got any contact details on your site, then editors may be a bit reluctant to allow your site under Regional/ as they can't confirm the details. Also, if you ever consider becoming an editor, your 'locality' is always a good place to consider starting - and we always need good editors...

[off topic] >> making TLIP the cheapest company to buy term insurance from. << Can you truely, honestly back that up with hard firm evidence? [back on topic] As I'm sure it's been said before, we don't "care" about your (or anybody elses) business model, it's just the sites and their content we really care about. >> We have never promoted our YRA site to you or anyone else and have no intention of ever doing so. << ODP editors have heard something like this many times before and we just ignore it...If your site "is of quality", it will be visited by an editor (and, maybe even listed) at some point. Whether you submit it, a third party does or an editor finds it themselves (as has happened in this instance) it will be found by us - the ODP cannot be stopped! Mwahhh! (sorry - lack of sleep <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" /> ) Personally, I'm not 100% sure why the URL was 'corrected' to YRA (as the YRA site is heavily under construction and the TLIP site seems to be mostly working), but I'm not too familar with the Insurance branches of ODP (and associated 'techniques'), but gimme a few hours to grab some sleep and I'll see if I 'think like the other editor' <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" />

http://dmoz.org/Regional/Europe/United_Kingdom/Business_and_Economy/Financial_Services/Insurance/Life_and_Pensions (beebs mutters darkly about cut'n'pasting the URL bar yet again) http://www.term-life-insurance-protection.co.uk/ was found to be a vanity/gateway/door-way/rebranding of http://www.yra.co.uk/ on the 1st of August. http://www.yra.co.uk/ is sitting in the unreviewed queue of that category with around 20 other sites. Insurance categories do attract a large amount of spam, so it may still be a few months before you submission is dealt with. Edit: windharp beat me by a couple of seconds <img src="/images/icons/frown.gif" alt="" /> Oh well, we were practically saying the same thing anyway... See http://dmoz.org/help/search.html#notlisted and http://dmoz.org/guidelines/include.html for details.

Yep - your site appears in the unreviewed for that category - along with only a very small handful of other sites. It's only been there a month though, so it may still be a few weeks before it gets reviewed. It is still waiting there and there is no need to resubmit to any Business/ category. You, may, however consider submitting to: http://dmoz.org/Regional/North_America/United_States/Michigan/Localities/F/Farmington/ as your business _appears_ to be based in Framington, Michigan, US (I say 'appears' as the contact details on your site do not 'tally' with those registered against the domain: if you have recently moved, I suggest you contact Register.com to ensure that they have the correct contact details for your internet domain name).

http://dmoz.org/Business/Industrial_Goods_and_Services/Machinery_and_Tools/Process_Equipment/Mixers_and_Dispensers/ (people - please please please provide 'clickable' URLs: cut'n'pasting the URL bar is actually quite easy) http://www.dispensetech.com/ does NOT appear in the unreviewed for that category, nor is there any record of it being approved, rejected or moved elsewhere. Are you sure the URL and category are correct?

Re: http://www.bdtzone.com/ Just agreeing with dfy here and in reference to BDTweb's post of the 29/08/02 at 12:28pm: >> unique content and such, BDTZone has that in spades << Please point this out, because so far editors have not been able to 'see' all this unique content that you have. >> undoubtedly worthy << Unfortently, we hear that from every webmaster/SEO out there. Very few people are willing to take a critical 'outsiders look' at their own site - especially where there is money involved... >> how can I get him to review it properly, << You can't make any editor do anything. We know - we've tried! ODP does have an internal 'review board' (made up of 'meta editors' - but any editor or 'surfer' can report alledged problems) which, when it is suspected that something may be amiss, do examine editors editing records (which store a h--ll of a lot of information!), but even then we can't "force" an editor to anything - we can only stop them causing further damage and make suggestions on how they can improve. >> I wish there was something that could be done with rd400d77 << If you honestly truly think that any editor is abusing their editing rights, please see http://dmoz.org/help/geninfo.html#abuse . But I've had a brief look into this, and I would say that there has been no abuse whatsover in relation to your site by any editor. To me, rd400d77 has been extremely helpful - editors are not forced to reply to submitters (sometimes we delibertly don't - but that's because people do get, erm, "extremely angry" when they find out their spam-filled page of adverts do not warrant a listing: mail-bombs, malicious mailing list subscriptions, personal attacks etc etc have all happened: all to people that willinging and freely volunteer their spare time to help make ODP better!) >> Do you think he may be reading this by chance? << Possibly, but that doesn't mean that we would know...Hell- Steve Case or Bill Gates might be reading this (if so, guys - can you hurry up and send that million dollar cheque to me that you owe?) As ettore said, can we please keep this on topic and try and avoid 'mudslinging' etc...

You weren't saying that last night peacefulone <img src="/images/icons/wink.gif" alt="" />

Please cut and paste the URL bar of the ODP category so you get a 'clickable URL' such as: http://dmoz.org/World/Espa%f1ol/Compras/Inform%e1tica/ - it makes our lives so much easier <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" /> Your site is sitting in the unreviewed of http://dmoz.org/World/Espa%f1ol/Compras/Inform%e1tica/ with around a dozen other sites. It's only been there 10 days - which is 'no time at all' really. Just be patient and wait a few more weeks (I suggest around 2 months from the submission date to be honest with you). I don't speak, read or understand Spanish in anyway, so I can't even comment if that is an appropriate place for your site or not...

Clickable category URLs do help - http://dmoz.org/World/Espa%f1ol/Pa%edses/Espa%f1a/Econom%eda_y_negocios/Compras/Inform%e1tica/ (especially for categories with 'foreign' characters in). That category has a handfull of sites awaiting review, but yours is NOT one of them. There is also no record of your site being 'touched' by an editor - are you sure that the category above is the one you submitted to?

Re: http://www.bdtzone.com/ Does your site sell anything ClearChoice/TestNegative doesn't?

0 unreviewed in http://dmoz.org/Regional/North_America/United_States/Idaho/Business_and_Economy/Construction_and_Maintenance (if you 'cut and paste' the URL bar - it preserves the underlines which help keep the URL 'clickable'). I've had a look for editor notes relating to: http://www.homebuiderbob.com/ , http://www.homebulderbob.com/ , and the 'proper URL' of: http://www.homebuilderbob.com/ - but nothing has been recorded for any of those. I suggest you resubmit - but don't ask me which categories... <img src="/images/icons/smile.gif" alt="" /> The Idaho one above 'appears' all right, but I don't edit under Regional/.../US/... (as I'm "UK" and both countries have slightly "different" ways of working within ODP).

3 months is a long time to be waiting, but you say >> I haven't got any email yet <<. Did you even get the 'Please reply to this confirm your email address?' mail? If that isn't responded to, your editor application doesn't even reach the 'human reviewers' (the 'meta editors').

Re: http://www.ringtonesearch.com Ok, try and imagine it this way: Company X supplies content to Site A and Site B. Site A + Site B offer nothing else but the content supplied by Company X (admiteddly 'repackaged') - there is no other 'unique content' on their sites. What benefit is there for _the end user_ to be presented with a list of search results that include Site A, Site B when they don't offer anything different from each other. The ODP ideal is for the directory to be designed and maintained for the _end user_ (i.e. 'Joe Public') and NOT for either our 'data partners' (such as Google - we don't particular 'care' if Google et al actually use the data or not) NOR for the webmasters in question. I haven't looked into the site in question in detail, but basically just 'summarising' what has previously been said. Does RingtoneSearch offer anything else but Stealthnet rebranded content?

Ok, if you go to a category page - you will hopefully see something like: >> Category editors: flame, glynis, liza, lundlinks, rapunzel, theseeker, voiceroy, wkn << (example taken from http://dmoz.org/Arts/ ). If you click on an editors name, you will be taken to their 'profile' page where you will see the option >> Email: Send to flame <<. Click on 'Send to ...' and enter your email. There is no method of getting an editors 'real' email address. Personally, since the start of this forum - I would try and avoid emailing editors regarding submissions. Mainly because emailing a single editor will rely on them a) being able to respond to your email [ie not being on vacation/busy] and b) wanting to respond. But if you post to this forum, many many editors will be able to assist you in your query and will be willing to help. As it is, I can tell you that you submission to Business/Marketing_and_Advertising/Advertising/ Promotional_Items/Business_Items/Cards was rejected in June this year as a previous submission was moved to the 'more appropriate' category of: Business/Industries/Printing/Stationery where it is awaiting review with around 150 other sites.

http://dmoz.org/Regional/North_America/United_States/Arizona/Business_and_Economy/Construction_and_Maintenance/Builders (please provide 'clickable' URLs as it is a lot quicker for us to check) has 0 unreviewed. http://dmoz.org/Regional/North_America/United_States/Idaho/Business_and_Economy/Construction_and_Maintenance/Builders - does not exist as a category. There is no record of http://www.homebuilderbob.com/ being 'touched' by an editor (i.e. no reject or acception notes). Please confirm you got the URL correct and which categories you submitted to.

Which category did you submit to?

If I remember correctly, the date on the ODP search results is the 'database change' date - the search database takes a while (last I heard was 3 days) to 'compile'. Therefore only sites in ODP listed 3 days before the 'search database' date will show up. Saying that, I've heard rumours that the search system is now tied into the RDF system (see http://dmoz.org/rdf.html for details), and therefore is only updated correctly when the RDF system produces a 'correct data dump'. Unfortently, it's been a little bit, shall we say, 'ill' recently and has been functioning 100% correctly. Staff @ ODP are aware of the problem and are working at it, so hopefully normality will be resumed shortly. In the meantime, I'll just turn into a penguin.

Basically, when an editor looks at each categories 'Unreviewed', they can have it sorted in several formats: a) Title of the site b) URL of the site c) Date of submission Therefore if I say it's position X in "my list" (I personally have them listed by URL as it's slightly easier to catch spam that way IMHO), it may not be the same position as the next person... But, all that is largely irrelevant, as editors are free to 'pick and choose' which ones to do. The way I personally work, is go through the list and delete/move obvious inappropriate submissions (for example: someone that's submitted every page of their site), and then I look at the list - and the first one that kinda stands out as "Title and Description look like they need minimal modification" - I start there (of course, I check that the site actually matches the submitted details). And the I can either go 'Next' or 'Previous' in the queue - and it's just random which way I go. I very rarely start at the first site and work my way down. Of course, what other editors do (and the order they do it), is up to them.

Queue size is 151, you site is still pending a review. Please don't submit http://www.example.com/ _and_ http://www.example.com/index.(html|asp|php) as it is possible an over zealous editor may note the domain name and delete _both_ submissions... just http://www.example.com/ will do. I've deleted the the URL in the latter style (and I'm deleting a few 'spam' submissions from the category so the number of unreviewed should drop to around 130...)

Oh, the "proper" link to the ODP's "Bobby report" is: http://bobby.watchfire.com/bobby/bobbyServlet?URL=http%3A%2F%2Fdmoz.org&output=Submit&gl=wcag1-aaa#bobbyReportText . The link you included pointed to the Google Directory, which while it _does_ use ODP data, has no "direct connection" with ODP. If they've got mistakes etc in their HTML, there's nothing anyone at ODP can do directly about it (bar drop them poilte emails).

That category has got a _massive_ backlog (but since it's a "second level" category, the majority of it is bound to be spam)... Your site _is_ in the queue, but it could be a while before it is reached for review... The queue list took around 2 minutes to load on my ADSL connection /images/icons/frown.gif >>> ADD << Actually, the 'Submission guidelines' for this category read: >> PLEASE NOTE! Please find the most appropriate sub-category for the site. By submitting to this more general category of Shopping/Jewelry, rather than a specific sub-category, your site may take up to 18 months to be listed. Submitting it to the proper sub-category (e.g. a site selling watches should be submitted to Shopping/Jewelry/Watches) will speed the review process. Find the single most appropriate category for your site. With few exceptions, sites will only be listed once in the directory. <<

ODP is hosted on the Netscape backbone within AOL, but due to security measures in place (packet filtering etc) it is extremely unlikely that traceroutes etc. can access dmoz.org at any time. Therefore, if your traceroute is failing - ODP may still be alive! BTW: It's back up now...

I suppose if it's a really tiny small category, you might be able to get away with just 2 sites - but please please try and enter 3. Why? Well, your application form is the main "item" the 'meta editors' (who accept new editors) have to judge applicants on. If it looks like a 'half-hearted' attempt or no visible effort was made (for example, if only 2 sites were entered but a Google search for appropriate sites comes up with several thousands) then it will count against you. Just fill in the form to the absolute best of your ability and you shouldn't go wrong...