Delays on URL submissions

From reading some of the other postings, I recognise that this is a hot potato so this will be like walking on eggs. Before a moderator writes me a prickly reply - I have been in the computer industry since 1966 (yes, that old) and I am a member of the BCS. So I don't need any sarcasm please.

My question about URL submission delays is this: I too have suffered a delay in having my submission in Business software/Human Resources reviewed, although nothing like the one year plus suffered by some posters. I appreciate that this a volunteer orgainsation, but if one takes on a project of this magnitude, surely one should try to match the available resource to the load?

DMOZ claims to be the most comprehensive URL directory ever, and the human editor is obviously essential to avoid spamming etc, but patently, the editor of the little section in which I am trying to get my site listed is already too busy. I tracked him down in Canada and emailed him to see if I had messed something up, but no reply. OK, I thought, if you are overworked, perhaps I could help by becoming an editor myself - after all I am semi-retired and I know the HR software business pretty well backward.

Sorry, came the reply, that position is already taken! My question is - if DMOZ is suffering delays of this magnitude, why not appoint additional editors?

The reason people get so frustrated and post critical comments on this site is because the DMOZ directory is commonly used as the basis for all manner of other 'piggy-back' directories. Therefore, they can't get their site listed on these before it's on DMOZ. The volume of other links generated by the additional sites is considerable and will directly affect the chance of getting listed in Google.

Net effect, DMOZ appears to be the bottle neck in achieving commercial promotion for your site, yet you can't do anything to fix the problem. With this many complaints, if I were a supplier I think I'd look seriously at how to improve my service rather than bollocking people for complaining.

Just as a postscript, whilst researching this problem, I came across the private website of a DMOZ editor, which suggested early reviews could be 'arranged' for a fee. Now that made my blood run cold!

I'd be interested in your (reasonably polite) views

DJH said:

From reading some of the other postings, ...... My question about URL submission delays is this: I too have suffered a delay in having my submission in Business software/Human Resources reviewed,

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If you would have read these other threads carefully you would have noticed that DMOZ does not a submission service at all. Everybody can suggest a site. And editors can (not must) use these sugegstions to build tge directory.

DJH said:

OK, I thought, if you are overworked, perhaps I could help by becoming an editor myself - after all I am semi-retired and I know the HR software business pretty well backward.

Sorry, came the reply, that position is already taken! My question is - if DMOZ is suffering delays of this magnitude, why not appoint additional editors?

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Why do people stop reading after they see the first possible reason given. From what you wrote I think you receive a mail with a list of standard reasons why the application is rejected. One or more of these reasons are applicable for your situation. Did you fi read the second part of that line which reads something like "or is to big for a new editor".

DJH said:

Net effect, DMOZ appears to be the bottle neck in achieving commercial promotion for your site, yet you can't do anything to fix the problem.

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Our advice is that if your company/site is depending on a DMOZ listing to be successful immediatley stop with what you are doing, delete the site from Internet and start something else because your company/site will never be a success.

DJH said:

With this many complaints, if I were a supplier I think I'd look seriously at how to improve my service rather than bollocking people for complaining.

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DMOZ is not the supplier in this case. You (and all other webmasters) are.

DJH said:

Just as a postscript, whilst researching this problem, I came across the private website of a DMOZ editor, which suggested early reviews could be 'arranged' for a fee. Now that made my blood run cold!

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Please let us know where we can find this website. This editor will be removed as soon as possible.
You can send a report through http://report-abuse.dmoz.org/

>I came across the private website of a DMOZ editor, which suggested early reviews could be 'arranged' for a fee.

If you really believe this might a current editor, you could report it as abuse. There are several websites that we know about, which make such claims routinely: some are by people who apparently never have been editors, and some are by people who became former editors as a result of such behavior. But, who knows, you might have found a new one.

>DMOZ appears to be the bottle neck in achieving commercial promotion for your site, yet you can't do anything to fix the problem.

THAT problem is perception, not reality. People who think DMOZ is the bottleneck toward commercial promotion are just delusional -- afflicted with mental deficiences so serious that they can't handle the facts: that is, all those myriads of commercially promoted sites that AREN'T listed in the ODP!

People like that have problems, I agree: but the solution is psychological help, not trying to transform reality to fit such seriously antisocial and irrational delusions.

No sarcasm here at all: I am persuaded that many of those folk are literally, verifiably insane. (Delusions of persection are orders of magnitude more common in ANY SERP perp forum than in the general population!)

But ... if the ODP were really a bottleneck of commercial promotion ... then what would it matter anyway? The ODP wasn't set up to do commercial promotion, and doesn't try. If you're looking at balancing supply and demand, there's clearly an oversupply of websites without any economic justification. Without adequate commercial promotion, they'd die?

And ... so that will take care of THAT problem.

There are all sorts of places that offer commercial promotion. Anyone may accept any of those offers -- so how can there be a shortage of commercial promotion?

But there is a shortage of what the ODP does best. Now THAT'S a problem which matters, THAT'S something worth caring about, THAT'S something we can do something about.

And if you're interested in promoting a topic by finding websites containing unique content about it -- you may be part of OUR solution.

But if not -- there are plenty of problems in the world, and if YOU work on solving some OTHER one, nobody here will presume to criticize your choice.

Sorry, came the reply, that position is already taken! My question is - if DMOZ is suffering delays of this magnitude, why not appoint additional editors?

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As pvgool mentions, the email you received likely said that the category was already in good hands or is broader in scope than we would like for new editors. The second part is usually the relevant part. In this case, I presume you actually applied for http://dmoz.org/Computers/Software/Human_Resources/ which, at 523 sites, is much too large for a new editor.

Please don't miss this, in my opinion it's the most important thing posted in this thread:

pvgool said:

Please let us know where we can find this website. This editor will be removed as soon as possible.
You can send a report through http://report-abuse.dmoz.org/

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If an editor is really selling expedited reviews, that editor will become a former editor in short order.

New topic: Use of language and its effects. If you use the wrong word for something, you can both receive and generate false expectations about that thing. You use the phrase "URL submissions" in the title of this thread. That phrase, one of my pet peeves, leads to false expectations. We do not solicit submissions of urls, we solicit submissions of suggestions for urls. Understanding the difference should lead you to a more realistic idea of what to expect. We take those suggestions seriously and read them all eventually, but we are under no obligation to decide on their merits in any particular time frame.

Third topic: A way you can save me some work if you're so inclined. If you were to edit your last post to remove all specific references to the perceived shortcomings of any specifically named person, you'd save me the trouble of doing so myself, or perhaps of deleting the entire post if I found the editing of it to be too much work.

DJH wrote: Our editor's personal website suggests that he is a very busy man. If so, why doesn't hand the reins over to someone who has the time to devote to this worthy task?

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That's another misconception people have, that an inactive editor is somehow taking up space and preventing someone else from editing the category.

brmehlman is much more polite than I am. I've deleted your previous post because, frankly, the whole thing was a personal rant against a specific editor.

More polite, or just slower? I came here now to delete the post if it wasn't fixed. Thanks for getting it for me.

Well, there you are then. You cannot criticise anyone connected with this forum,no matter how politely put. A moderator can make snide remarks, but delete your reply. Free speech still rules then?

Where?

Free speech? Ummm, did you lose me somewhere or did we take a wrong turn at the "Moderated" sign?

NiV23

Free speech

The Open Directory Project thoroughly approves of free speech. Provided that it happens somewhere else.

This is a moderated forum on the subject of matters relating to the ODP. It does not cover, inter alia, editors' body odours, personal habits, general ineptitude, political indispositions, the status of a suggestion made aons ago, the status of a suggestion made more recently, nor where in Manhattan one can buy a high-quality pork pie.

Nor where in Manhattan one can buy real beer. Oh for a pint of Harvey Sussex!

I don't want to get into the tit for tat. I have one very simple question. Why can't I even suggest a URL? Every time I have tried (over the past several months) the service is "temporarily" unavailable. Please define your understanding of "temporarily".

Thanks,
serenity

It's defined at the top of the forum index under forum announcements

http://www.resource-zone.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=45325

And please note that the temporary unavailability has only been since October 20. If you've been having trouble for several months, there's a problem at your end.

No problem on this end. Before Oct. 20th I must have hit it at temporary down times. The rudeness in responses to valid questions and complaints here, seems so immature. Why is it not possible to get a straight answer about when submission will again be accepted, politely. If you really don't have any idea, say so, but don't come across like some pompus jerk that thinks it is totally unreasonable for a webmaster to want to suggest a URL. After all, ODP is the one asking for the suggestions. May someone should remove the "suggest URL" from all page and make a POLITE statement explaining the the link will be reinstalled after the site is up and running. It would be much easier for people to understand if the weren't being solicited on one hand and insulted on the other.

serenity

If you really don't have any idea, say so

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It has been said, in a great many threads as well as in the Announcement posted at the top of the forum.. It is understandable that replies are a little abrupt when people ask the same questions that have been answered many many times in the previous week or two.
To quote from that Announcement:

We do not currently have an ETA for the resolution of the technical difficulties. We will update this announcement when the system is fully functioning again -- please do not start threads asking why the system isn't working properly or when it will be available again.

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No problem on this end. Before Oct. 20th I must have hit it at temporary down times.

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Seems odd that you would continually hit temporary down times, considering that any down times would have lasted seconds (i.e. there have been no rolling outages over the last several months). Perhaps your ISP is having trouble. If you still have trouble when the server is available again, then I would suggest you talk to them.

The rudeness in responses to valid questions and complaints here, seems so immature.

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Who has been rude to you here? You've gotten two responses, both of them polite...something, I might add, your posts haven't been.

Why is it not possible to get a straight answer about when submission will again be accepted, politely.

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The information in that announcement thread is the only answer we have.

If you really don't have any idea, say so...

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That announcement very clearly states "We do not currently have an ETA for the resolution of the technical difficulties." If that changes, the announcement will be updated accordingly. I'm not sure what exactly you're looking for.

but don't come across like some pompus jerk that thinks it is totally unreasonable for a webmaster to want to suggest a URL. After all, ODP is the one asking for the suggestions.

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Actually, we're not "asking" for suggestions. We're offering people an easy way (when it's working) to suggest their site to us...as a courtesy. We could build the directory just as well without that courtesy but it is useful in some categories.

May someone should remove the "suggest URL" from all page and make a POLITE statement explaining the the link will be reinstalled after the site is up and running. It would be much easier for people to understand if the weren't being solicited on one hand and insulted on the other.

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So, you're saying that the technical difficulties message is insulting to you? It seems quite polite to me.

Then it should be just as understandable when we get frustrated with the same answer again and again. The " I don't know" answer gets old too.

What answer would you like? We don't have another answer for you. Asking us over and over and over again isn't going to make another answer appear out of thin air.

we get frustrated with the same answer

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A little perspective might be helpful here. Apart from the fact that we simply cannot give you a different answer, as motsa pointed out, have you considered that your frustration concerns only your own site and your own interests, whereas the frustration for volunteer editors is that we are unable to work on building the tens of thousands of categories in the ODP?

Maybe you do not realise that editors have no control over the hardware the site runs on, and have no influence on those paid employees of AOL that do... so what you have here is what we have to work with too.