I will like to now how odp allow Anti-Semitic category http://www.dmoz.org/Society/Issues/Race-Ethnic-Religious_Relations/Hate/Hate_Groups/Anti-Semitic/
How odp allow Anti-Semitic category
- Thread starter aki
- Start date
If you don't have any cultural sensitivity, at least try to fake it!
Don't you realize that not only the editors who work in Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Judaism, but also the surfers, are likely to be themselves Jews? If you were religious, or were a member of some ethnic or cultural group that you could take pride in, how would you like to trip over sites like "Kill all the AKIs to keep them from taking over the world!" and "AKI conspiracy to spread AIDS" and all the other "AKI watch" ... have you LOOKED at some of those sites?
We want editors who are enthusiastic about the topics they edit in, and such editors are especially likely to be offended by, and NOT to want to review, websites expressing vicious opposing views. So we keep such sites separate.
Don't you realize that not only the editors who work in Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Judaism, but also the surfers, are likely to be themselves Jews? If you were religious, or were a member of some ethnic or cultural group that you could take pride in, how would you like to trip over sites like "Kill all the AKIs to keep them from taking over the world!" and "AKI conspiracy to spread AIDS" and all the other "AKI watch" ... have you LOOKED at some of those sites?
We want editors who are enthusiastic about the topics they edit in, and such editors are especially likely to be offended by, and NOT to want to review, websites expressing vicious opposing views. So we keep such sites separate.
How would hiding this information help anyone?
Ignoring bad people doesn't make them go away, as the Jews in particular have learned to our cost. What if Jewish advocacy groups want to know what groups might be a threat to them? Personally, I'd much rather the identity of anti-Semitic and other hate groups be fully publicly disclosed, so we can all act accordingly. If there are neo-Nazis in my area, I want to know about it, and be able to see what if anything they're fomenting.
Ignoring bad people doesn't make them go away, as the Jews in particular have learned to our cost. What if Jewish advocacy groups want to know what groups might be a threat to them? Personally, I'd much rather the identity of anti-Semitic and other hate groups be fully publicly disclosed, so we can all act accordingly. If there are neo-Nazis in my area, I want to know about it, and be able to see what if anything they're fomenting.
hutcheson
“If you don't have any cultural sensitivity, at least try to fake it!
Don't you realize that not only the editors who work in Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Judaism, but also the surfers, are likely to be themselves Jews?”
I am a Jew and that is the risen way I asking.
By entering this category you give them publicity
“If you don't have any cultural sensitivity, at least try to fake it!
Don't you realize that not only the editors who work in Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Judaism, but also the surfers, are likely to be themselves Jews?”
I am a Jew and that is the risen way I asking.
By entering this category you give them publicity
Think of it like a map of the United States. Do you include New Jersey, and "give publicity" to organized crime? Or do you leave New Jersey off the map, to try to make the Atlantic Ocean seem cleaner?
We map the web. All the web: the good, the bad, and the ugly. Of course, you have to realize is that editors don't all agree on what's good. But we can agree whether New Jersey exists, and since it exists, we list it.
Publicity? That is not our problem. However, I edit some religious categories, and I firmly believe "those who do evil hate the light." I think of the ODP as shining a light. The rabid babbling of hate groups may go over well with their members. But their neighbors, their employees, and their associates that are not yet so deep in pure evil, will be horrified to see what kind of evil is being spread around them.
We map the web. All the web: the good, the bad, and the ugly. Of course, you have to realize is that editors don't all agree on what's good. But we can agree whether New Jersey exists, and since it exists, we list it.
Publicity? That is not our problem. However, I edit some religious categories, and I firmly believe "those who do evil hate the light." I think of the ODP as shining a light. The rabid babbling of hate groups may go over well with their members. But their neighbors, their employees, and their associates that are not yet so deep in pure evil, will be horrified to see what kind of evil is being spread around them.
Hi hutcheson
“We map the web. All the web: the good, the bad, and the ugly”
Don’t take thit as a personal attack but you are according to your Profile a Christian and on dmoz i don’t find “Anti Christian” http://search.dmoz.org/cgi-bin/sear...es&cs=UTF-8&cat=Society/Crime/Organized_Crime but on google http://www.google.com/search?q=Anti Christian&ie=utf8 there is 3780000 results
“We map the web. All the web: the good, the bad, and the ugly”
Don’t take thit as a personal attack but you are according to your Profile a Christian and on dmoz i don’t find “Anti Christian” http://search.dmoz.org/cgi-bin/sear...es&cs=UTF-8&cat=Society/Crime/Organized_Crime but on google http://www.google.com/search?q=Anti Christian&ie=utf8 there is 3780000 results
1. The ODP search has a bug and isn't returning sites or categories correctly at the moment.
2. When it is working, it does not always return the results you would expect. ODP is a directory, not a search engine.
3. http://dmoz.org/Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Opposing_Views/Christianity/
2. When it is working, it does not always return the results you would expect. ODP is a directory, not a search engine.
3. http://dmoz.org/Society/Religion_and_Spirituality/Opposing_Views/Christianity/
That's right. The ODP lists 662 "Opposing Views/Christianity" sites, and, um, 20 "Opposing Views/Judaism" sites. Of those sites opposing Judaism, half are categorized as "Hate Groups". Of the sites opposing Christianity, approximately, um, zero halves are characterized as "hate groups."
Them's the facts. I can't very well take that as a personal attack, can I? I'm not sure how I could even take it as an attack on the ODP. It is pretty clear, though, that the ODP is extremely sensitive to Jewish sensibilities, isn't it? Since half the anti-Jewish sites are categorized as "hate groups"? Is that what you were trying to show? If not, I still don't get your point. Could you explain your line of reasoning more clearly?
Now, I'm personally not fond of random statistics. Without some knowledge of how they were sampled, they are pretty meaningless. We don't do statistics, anyway, we review websites. So, if there is any constructive suggestion hiding behind your innuendos, is it:
(1) There are some anti-Christian groups that we SHOULD describe as "Hate Groups", but because we don't care about Christian sensibilities, we don't? (If so, just name them.)
(2) There are some anti-Christian hate groups that have websites that we haven't listed at all. (If so, name them.)
(3) We have been unfair to anti-Semites by listing some sites as "Hate Groups" when they are really just opposing a false religion, and we should move those sites back to the "Opposing Views" category. (If so, name the sites!)
If you can't name a site that the ODP hasn't fairly represented, or have unfairly omitted, then ... what else could possibly be the problem?
Them's the facts. I can't very well take that as a personal attack, can I? I'm not sure how I could even take it as an attack on the ODP. It is pretty clear, though, that the ODP is extremely sensitive to Jewish sensibilities, isn't it? Since half the anti-Jewish sites are categorized as "hate groups"? Is that what you were trying to show? If not, I still don't get your point. Could you explain your line of reasoning more clearly?
Now, I'm personally not fond of random statistics. Without some knowledge of how they were sampled, they are pretty meaningless. We don't do statistics, anyway, we review websites. So, if there is any constructive suggestion hiding behind your innuendos, is it:
(1) There are some anti-Christian groups that we SHOULD describe as "Hate Groups", but because we don't care about Christian sensibilities, we don't? (If so, just name them.)
(2) There are some anti-Christian hate groups that have websites that we haven't listed at all. (If so, name them.)
(3) We have been unfair to anti-Semites by listing some sites as "Hate Groups" when they are really just opposing a false religion, and we should move those sites back to the "Opposing Views" category. (If so, name the sites!)
If you can't name a site that the ODP hasn't fairly represented, or have unfairly omitted, then ... what else could possibly be the problem?
Hi Aki, there are really two issues here: 1) why do we have an Anti-Semitic Hate Groups category and 2) why do we list sites like this at all. Hutcheson was originally answering question #1 when he spoke of cultural sensitivity. If there were no Anti-Semitic Hate Groups category, the hate group sites would have to go in the Judaism category, and it would cause distress to Judaism editors to have to see these sites there on a daily basis. Placing them under Hate Groups is less offensive to Jewish editors and users.
#2 is what I originally addressed with my first post in this thread. Anti-Semitic and white supremacist groups already exist, and sweeping them under the carpet won't make them go away. There are legitimate reasons for decent people to want to know about these sites and these organizations. The ADL also links to them; are they helping the hate groups by giving them publicity?
As an editor, my position is similar to Hutcheson's--I think that shining a light on these people's activities is good journalism and raises awareness of anti-Semitism and racism. As a Jew, I feel still more strongly about it--I think that the old shtetl mentality of ignoring our enemies and hoping they go away has served us terribly badly this last century, and if there are neo-Nazi groups operating in my area, then I personally want their URL, their address, and a detailed report on what they're up to. Knowledge is power.
#2 is what I originally addressed with my first post in this thread. Anti-Semitic and white supremacist groups already exist, and sweeping them under the carpet won't make them go away. There are legitimate reasons for decent people to want to know about these sites and these organizations. The ADL also links to them; are they helping the hate groups by giving them publicity?
As an editor, my position is similar to Hutcheson's--I think that shining a light on these people's activities is good journalism and raises awareness of anti-Semitism and racism. As a Jew, I feel still more strongly about it--I think that the old shtetl mentality of ignoring our enemies and hoping they go away has served us terribly badly this last century, and if there are neo-Nazi groups operating in my area, then I personally want their URL, their address, and a detailed report on what they're up to. Knowledge is power.
bobrat
Member
- Joined
- Apr 15, 2003
- Messages
- 11,061
Once you start censoring where do you stop? I may not like those sites, but once someone starts promoting a specific viewpoint and leaving some things out, then where does it stop? As flicker says, awareness of these sites probably in the end is better, then the public knows what is really out there, and can expose them for what they are.
ODP will not list a site that is clearly illegal, and attempts to put Adult sites in the Adult section and children friendly sites in http://www.dmoz.org/Kids_and_Teens/
Other than that it's Open.
ODP will not list a site that is clearly illegal, and attempts to put Adult sites in the Adult section and children friendly sites in http://www.dmoz.org/Kids_and_Teens/
Other than that it's Open.