Justice in listing!!! please help me!!!

Gentlemen,

I have tried for more than two year to have my websites of services in Europe to the North American (US and Canadian) population listed in DMOZ, but I do not succeed.

For some strange reason my sites do not get listed, even when I have asked a few times to be listed, there are similar sites of people who do the same thing as me, but they are national to US and Canada and do not propose the service in Europe or International. Please note the services are in Europe but for North Americans and must be listed under North America and Europe under "Process Servers".

I do not see anything wrong with my site or services, sites are in English, do not have publicity but educational material, not porno at all but of legal contents.... see my sites if needed please and tell me what is wrong other than having to mention them as evidence.

(URLS removed per terms of service)


I wonder if you can help me solve this problem and get listed, since I have never received a reject notification from the editor, or a note for me to appeal the decision of the editor and clear out any doubts, I do not even know if I have been ban because of being wrongfully considered a spammer....

I kindly ask you to be fair and help me solve this.

Thank you

even when I have asked a few times to be listed

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Few? Where I come from, few means 5 at the very most.

There's not much sympathy around here for people that suggest websites more than a couple of times or to multiple categories (with the honourable multi language and Regional exceptions).

As to justice, the laws of the land prevent us from meting out appropriate justice to people who ignore our suggestion guidelines and so cause extra work for our volunteers and contribute to processing slowdowns for everybody.

"Justice..."

You use that word a lot. I don't think it means what you think it means.

Here, it means you have to follow the terms of service, just like everyone else does.

When editors review websites at dmoz.org, it means they focus exclusively on what (in their best disinterested judgment) they think the category needs, not at all what website owners want.

More generally, a lot of people have the idea that it means Mother Teresa can't feed a starving child in India, if there might be another, hungrier child anwhere in the world. But that work is all about "generosity": justice isn't involved. Justice says: it's your money, you have the absolute right to offer food to anyone, even if they aren't hungry at all.

Jusitice please!

Gentlemen,

Please understand that some of us including sites in the DMOZ engine are not professionals of Computers and in some cases our language is not English.

In my case, I am an Attorney who is his own web master and whos monther tongue is Spanish and to communicate in English I have a friend that helps me for computers I am even learning linux.

Please excuse my ignorance and limitations and if I make you waist your time, but please help me with this, mùy excuse is the following:

I was told and it seems to be the "profanes in Computers understanding" that you must submit and resubmit often your site to search engines, that pages are indexed separetly...

On the other hand, I kindly ask you to improve the ODP site submition form by sending back an email to the submitter indicating him his success or errors, this way you will be also educating us who make mistakes and giving us the opportunity to solve any errors.

To conclude, is there is anything I can do to solve this problem of being excluded or should I desist of being listed forever? Is there a period of time I should wait before submmiting again, as punishement? What can I do for DMOZ to pay for my sins? Please let me know.

Please understand that some of us including sites in the DMOZ engine are not professionals of Computers and in some cases our language is not English.

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That is also true for many of the DMOZ editors (including myself) Let's see if I can make things a little clearer, because there are some things about DMOZ that you seem to have misunderstood.

you must submit and resubmit often your site to search engines, that pages are indexed separetly...

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dmoz.org is not a search engine, so whatever applies to search engines does not apply to the DMOZ directory. In DMOZ (or, as we usually call it, the ODP), each site is listed in a category based on the content of the site; each page in a web site is not listed, only the site as a whole. We don't "index" sites. Once a site has been suggested for review, the suggestion does not disappear; it waits until a human volunteer editor decides to review suggested sites in the category. Thus, there is no need to send a site more than once. Indeed, to suggest it many times is often counterproductive because it leads to longer review times for all suggested sites.

To conclude, is there is anything I can do to solve this problem of being excluded or should I desist of being listed forever? Is there a period of time I should wait before submmiting again, as punishement? What can I do for DMOZ to pay for my sins? Please let me know.

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You need do nothing more. If your site is of the type we list, and it has not been listed, it is almost certainly still waiting for review. There is no way of telling how long it will take until somebody reviews it, but there is nothing you can do to speed up the process, and as I said above, please do not send it again, because that is only likely to make things slower. There is also no need to apologise. Many people don't understand what the ODP is about, but you had the courtesy to ask about it, and we're more than happy to explain.

delacuetara said:

and in some cases our language is not English.

In my case, I am an Attorney who is his own web master and whos monther tongue is Spanish

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On DMOZ and here on Resource-Zone we have special sections for many languages. Including one for Spanish. If you feel more comfortable you can write in Spanish in that section and you will be answered in Spanish.

I was told and it seems to be the "profanes in Computers understanding" that you must submit and resubmit often your site to search engines, that pages are indexed separetly...

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Nea has already written that DMOZ is not a search engine and explained how we work.
But even for the search engines repeated submissions of you website and submissions of pages on your website is a big No. They don't like it and there are several that will punish you for such behaviour.

On the other hand, I kindly ask you to improve the ODP site submition form by sending back an email to the submitter indicating him his success or errors, this way you will be also educating us who make mistakes and giving us the opportunity to solve any errors.

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You are shown a message on screen which tells you the suggestion has been received. There is only one error you can make and that is suggesting a website that we do not want to list (the DMOZ guidelines, available in Spanish, explain very clearly which kind of websites we do not list). All other mistakes you might make are so small that editors will correct them, no problem we are used to making these changes.

To conclude, is there is anything I can do to solve this problem of being excluded

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No. Except to not suggest your website anymore.

Is there a period of time I should wait before submmiting again,

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Yes and No. You should not suggest your website anymore. Once is enough.

Thank you all, I'm still not listed but...

I thank you all for your time and I will like a couple of suggestions that will avoid you extra waist of time:

1. A person submitting a site for listing should be able to see if his site is on a waiting list for the editor's review, indeed some of us have more than one site and very bad memory and this tell the public their "Listing Status".
2. Or if a domain is in waiting list, if submitted, taking in consideration the domain name a message of "pending review" should show. The if there are pages related to that domain, the submition will be stopped.
3. If a site is rejected because of X reason an email should be sent to the submiter this way he will be able to correct his error and proceed.

These 3 sugestions I belive will reduce your efforts.

I undertand it is true that publishers should read the instructions but you know how it goes "If you can not make it work, then... read the instructions"
but also note the old linux saying "If it is not broken, dont fix it"

In our opinion it is not broken, so ......

These suggestions have all been made many times.
And everytime the answer was like:
These suggestions are not improving DMOZ or any of the services it is offering.
We know that many things can be improved but these imrpovements should be usefull for either the users of DMOZ or the editors.
DMOZ does not provide a service to get websites listed. Any suggestions to implement such a service are not usefull for the directory, its users or the editors.

> some of us have more than one site
We request not to suggest sites that are related to each other. Having the same owner makes wesbites automaticaly related to each other. So only suggest one of these websites.
> if there are pages related to that domain,
You are not allowed to suggest pages. Only a website may be suggested.
> If a site is rejected because of X reason an email should be sent to the submiter
All reasons for which a website will be rejected are already available for everybody to read.
> this way he will be able to correct his error and proceed.
The reasons for which we reject websites can not be corrected. Unless you drop the complete content and intentions of the website and start all over again.
Everybody should proceed with their website not caring about it being listed in DMOZ or not. You should build a website for your vistors in a way you think is appropriate. Don't build websites to be included in serach engines or directories, we are very good at spotting such websites (and rejectiong them).

Conclusion: Stop worrying about a potential listing of your website in DMOZ.

pvgool said:

In our opinion it is not broken, so ......


> If a site is rejected because of X reason an email should be sent to the submiter
All reasons for which a website will be rejected are already available for everybody to read.
> this way he will be able to correct his error and proceed.
The reasons for which we reject websites can not be corrected. Unless you drop the complete content and intentions of the website and start all over again.

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i completely agree with the idea that an email should be sent.
I know so busy so called editors will not be able to send detail emails but atleast the submitter should have idea why her site was not accepted...(as it is called public directory)...even google does that with adsense and adwords...
email may be ok "Your site was found spammy"....."Illegal contents"...."keywords spam in heading"....
i think this will definately help...

me as well, from last 3 years havenot been able to submit one portal,totally legitimate...non spammy...every directory accepts it ,but we dont have idea, why dmoz doesnt...so email would have saved our some years...

pvgool said:

In
Conclusion: Stop worrying about a potential listing of your website in DMOZ.

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personally i also feel listing in dmoz is NOT that essential...after all there are millions of sources to drive traffic,inform users,get backlinks(dmoz may be nofollow)....in addition ,may be in our case,in our country users even doesnt use dmoz that much ...so we dont expect huge number of visitors....
BUT
i dont know it is myth or truth...but many so called seo experts says google SERP and dmoz has some connections......so may be going on that myth...running to get listed

some other sevices now a days use dmoz listing in their services...esp so called website valuation sites...and we know "no dmoz listing" is not big thing but our clients,potential visitors or users of the site may misintrepret it as "site having some problems...thats why it doesnt have dmoz listing yet even in such a long time"...

plus in hosting business....we have found that some users takes dmoz listing,alexa as index to measure site and company's reputation....
so may be sometimes you need to get listed for others....

frank1 said:

i completely agree with the idea that an email should be sent.
I know so busy so called editors will not be able to send detail emails but atleast the submitter should have idea why her site was not accepted...(as it is called public directory)...even google does that with adsense and adwords...
email may be ok "Your site was found spammy"....."Illegal contents"...."keywords spam in heading"....
i think this will definately help...

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As has been sais many times before.
The guidelines we use to accept or reject a website for listing are already publicy available and when you suggest a website you aknowledge that you have read them and that you will not suggest websites we do not want to list.

Please reread
http://www.dmoz.org/add.html
http://www.dmoz.org/help/submit.html
http://www.dmoz.org/guidelines/include.html
http://www.dmoz.org/guidelines/site-specific.html

Why would we have to tell people that we caught a website they suggested that is not listable when they should not have suggested that website at all.
They just waisted precious editor time. And by doing so they mad all honest people have to wait longer before we reviewed their website.

There is never a reason to tell people why their website will not be listed. We do not want those people to kwow that we caught their spam.

For all other people / websites. If the suggested website is not listed yet it is still waiting review.

And abouth that myth. We have tried to educate people but they prefer to keep listening to so called seo experts instead of to the people that realy know what they are talking about.

thanks for your valuable thoughts....
But
i think situation like this are always not that clear...means
editor links it is not as per rules
submitter thinks it is as per rules...
not to reconcile some thing is required......
so that email can do.

Only is case of spammer they will go against the TOS and still argue to get listed or may be even dont bother to do that bcoz they already know why there sites are not there...

but for non spammer who wants their sites there and editors doesnt think so ...there always will be some confusion,misunderstanding etc...
for eg,i tried to get my 2 years country webhosting site approved,as per rules i dont think i have done any thing wrong but i dont pass....
so....how many times may i read those TOS i wont get through...


about the myth,playing with seo for some years,i have seen/read that if the pages lack meta then dmoz description is used sometimes....from my technical aspect....
above that there is huge misunderstanding among our clients,customers...so as "customers are always right" rather than arguing with them ...better to go with them for now....

The OP's questions have been answered and so this thread has run its course. Closing.