moving from basic to full service

I originally submitted my site to

http://www.dmoz.org/Computers/Internet/Web_Design_and_Development/Designers/Full_Service/M/

and after checking the status

http://resource-zone.com/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=57259&page=0&view=collapsed&sb=5&o=&fpart=1

I was told that it was moved to basic and still pending. I offer a full range of development services. Would someone please help me in moving back to Full Service for consideration in the above mentioned category? Thank you.

Have you read the category description for Full Service? Does your website meet all that criteria?

Yes my website meets the criteria.

Sorry I can't review the site because it is Flash only

I understand... I guess I'll wait it out here in the forum.

Thank you for your help though.

1. Comments as a user. I do not have enough time in my life to have to wait through flash intros. You should at least let me skip it. Once I get to the site, it's very hard to read, grey text on grey blue doesn't work too well. I also hate annoying background music, that forces me to adjust my speaker volume. As a customer, you lost me.

2. Comments as an editor [who cannot edit.modify.move your site]. Many editors don't have time to waste with Flash intros, or don't have the bandwidth, and will postpone editing your site. Parts of your site says 'coming soon' and 'site redesign in progress', might be construed by some editors as a site under construction, and not ready to list. Under services - what you list there at first glance in my view is not enough to move it from basic services - unless the editor happens to notice the digit 2 - which is kind of hidden [Purple text on purple] - which gets to a second page, which might justify moving to a second category. But I shouldn't have to work so hard to find out what you do. Also the load time for each page is way too slow and I'm on high speed DSL - normally if a site loads this slow, I'll skip it, leave it in the heap for some other day when maybe the bits fly faster, and get onto to another site to review.

Based on what bobrat says my opinion is leave it in Basic Service and hope for the best or totally redesign with html only content and a way to bypass any flash intros.

Good Luck!

Hope this Helps!

In regard to your comments as a user:

There is a play, stop, pause and volume control for the music on the site. Very easily seen too.

In regard to the rest of your comments:

There really is no intro... that is the application contacting the database for the information.

All of the information that you construed as under construction is merely news to let people know of updates.

You wrote: "But I shouldn't have to work so hard to find out what you do."

That is not an editorial position, but a personal/user stance. From the get go you weren't enamored with the site because it is in Flash.

I suppose you also would not like http://www.2advanced.com either? They are an industry leader.

Thank you for your help, thehelper. You are a lot more help than bobrat.

It is just terrible that a flash only site cannot be indexed. It is up to the developer, not the editor to decide which medium to convey their website.

They can't be spidered by google either. Sucks to be flash only - it does not have to be that way. Check you later - redesign your site and check back in a month - leave it the way it is and check back quarterly. Peace - and

Hope this helps -

Thank you thehelper. I'll check back in 3 months.

Peace be with you...

That is not an editorial position, but a personal/user stance. From the get go you weren't enamored with the site because it is in Flash.

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Actually it's both, as a user, I don't have time for Flash. As a webdesigner, you should be aware of that attitude in potential customers.

From an editorial point of view, it's not whether editors like Flash or not, we're supposed to be unbiased, and sites are not excluded becuase they use Flash. But realistically, many editors do not have Flash installed, and can't review sites using it, or delay reviewing because of the extra effort and time required.

Take a deep breath, don't take my comments so personally, they might actually help your business.

Personally my first inclination would be that this site belongs in Basic_Service but you can always resubmit the site to the Full_Service category and make note in the description field that you want the site to be re-reviewed against the Full_Service criteria. Just leave the note [in square brackets] after the description that you write.

It is just terrible that a flash only site cannot be indexed.

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It's also not true. I personally dislike almost all Flash-only sites -- though there is the extremely rare exception where Flash is integral to, or the best way to display, the content. On the platforms I use, I frequently can't see Flash sites. However, I have listed numerous sites that require Flash. I personally consider most sites that require Flash to be poor web design and poor marketing, but the editorial standard of the ODP is content, not design or marketing.

Now, because I can't always see them, it often takes me much longer to review a Flash-only site. On the occasions when I can view them, I'll review them right away, just like any other site. However, other times, I just have to leave them waiting until I (or someone else) can get to them on a platform that can see them. The longer average wait time for review is just one price the designer pays for excluding some people from his/her site. However, the site will eventually be reviewed, and the fact that it requires Flash should not influence the listing decision at all.

[Added] There were lots of other comments on the subject, but I'll leave this as it directly addresses a question that I don't think was answered.[/Added]

The official ODP approach to this is:

1) Editors should include special requirements in brackets after the description. For example: [requires Flash] or [may not work on some browsers].
2) As in everything, editors aren't required to do what they don't want to do. I don't list Flash-only sites. ever. I don't have Flash on my machine. (I add the note as in (1), and leave them for someone else to review. Any editor can do that with any site.)
3) I do skip Flash intros if possible, and review the WEB portion of the website for listing.

If you call yourself a web designer, you really ought to use your website to show something about your ability to design good user interfaces and search-engine-friendly pages, as well as your ability to choose appropriate technologies. If you consider that is what this website shows, I can only admire your courage in providing full disclosure.

It is up to the developer, not the editor to decide which medium to convey their website.

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I agree with this. Webmasters should build websites however they feel most appropriately serves the design goal. We list sites which use many different technologies, including flash. Hopefully, not having a non-flash version of your site will not delay the listing too much.

In the interim, and beside this thread, your site is now listed in this category , which shouldn't have any bearing on either the basic or full-service listing you have requested in your posts above. Good luck.

Thank you knovinc for all of your help.

http://www.webproworld.com/viewtopic.php?t=9899

All I asked was why I was changed to basic from full service and I was ganged up on by a host of editor thugs. Even though it'll hurt me in the search engines... I'll have to say TO HELL WITH DMOZ!!

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