ODP Policy

ave13co · Apr 11, 2004

I have a situation where my site has not yet been accepted to the ODP. I have applied twice during the last 6 months. I have heard nothing about it from anyone yet.

I have also chosen a category where there are to be no sites with commercial content(ODP policy for that category)... yet that particular category is FULL of commercial content.
My site is an auction... but it is FREE so I am not selling anything.. The users will be.
There are stores,auctions,flea markets and trade area's in this category.

Whats the deal on how to have your site listed??

xixtas01 · Apr 11, 2004

If this is the site in your profile, I see nothing in http://www.dmoz.org/Shopping/Auctions/Computers/ which precludes listing commercial interests. Perhaps I'm missing something.

Many sites wait longer than 6 months from the date they are submitted to be listed.

bobrat · Apr 11, 2004

Just because a site is not listed, does not mean it has been rejected, there is often a large backlog - six monthss is not unusual - and if you keep submtting your site, your are doing youself and the ODP editors a disservice. On the other hand no site is guaranteed a listing.

If you wish to post a specific question about your site you may do so in the Site Submission Status forum - provided you read and follow the posting guidelines with great care.

The vague and unprecise answer is - auctions are auctions and belong in an auction category, by definition auctions sell things.

ave13co · Apr 11, 2004

Wrong category

xixtas01 said:
If this is the site in your profile, I see nothing in http://www.dmoz.org/Shopping/Auctions/Computers/ which precludes listing commercial interests. Perhaps I'm missing something.

Many sites wait longer than 6 months from the date they are submitted to be listed.

The cat in question is....

http://dmoz.org/Recreation/Collecting/Computers/

If you look through those sites,you will find an auction,flea markets,stores,buy and sell areas,links inviting you to a very well known auctionsite to buy the authors goods....Is this not considered commercial??

Yet when you go to where you are to apply to join this category, it specificly says there will be no sites with commercial content allowed.

I guess I will have to wait till I hear from them but I would like to understand this policy more...

motsa · Apr 11, 2004

ave13co said:
The cat in question is....

http://dmoz.org/Recreation/Collecting/Computers

If you look through those sites,you will find an auction,flea markets,stores,buy and sell areas,links inviting you to a very well known auctionsite to buy the authors goods....Is this not considered commercial??

Informational sites about computer collecting that happen to include some affiliate links or links to the owner's online auction pages do not violate the category's guidelines. An auction or classifieds site, on the other hand, by it's very nature is not an informational site but is a site selling things (regardless of whether or not people have to pay a fee to buy or sell). Therefore, an auction site can only be listed in Shopping, not in Recreation. I took a quick and random look through the sites listed in the Recreation category and I'm not seeing any sites that are purely auction or commercial sites.

[added: actually, I found one whose content appears to have changed somewhat, that is now more appropriate for Shopping but that was the only one out of the ones I looked at]

bobrat · Apr 11, 2004

On a lighter note, I've got a couple of Ataris's with software and cartridges and an Exidy Sorcerer with a CP/M expansion box, and an original Psion. I'll keep you in mind.

motsa · Apr 11, 2004

Just wanted to add a note: we list sites based on the content they have now, not content they might have in the future. Therefore, it's entirely likely that you have been or will be denied a listing because of the lack of actual auctions on the site (I see only 21, all from the same person).

ave13co · Apr 11, 2004

Rule Change

motsa said:
Just wanted to add a note: we list sites based on the content they have now, not content they might have in the future. Therefore, it's entirely likely that you have been or will be denied a listing because of the lack of actual auctions on the site (I see only 21, all from the same person).

I see the rules have changed since I last posted....

"Acceptable sites should contain original content pertaining to the acquisition, display, identification, and conservation of computers that would be useful or of interest to collectors. For quick review please search through the subcategories to find the correct placement of your site. All sites, which offer products and collectibles for sale on line and off line, should be submitted to Shopping/Antiques_and_Collectibles. Commercial sites will not be accepted in this category.
category description"

motsa · Apr 11, 2004

Not sure what you're getting at there, ave13co. The only thing that has changed in that description since it was first put in over 2.5 years ago is that the reference to Shopping: Antiques and Collectibles was made into a clickable link in the last day or so. Nothing else had been touched since 2001, let alone since your post.

giz · Apr 11, 2004

Oooh, don't forget that editor-side changes can take a week to show up on the public side, so something done several days ago, might only just show up now.

motsa · Apr 12, 2004

And? The point I was making is that the only change made to the description/submission guidelines since 2001 was that the link to the Shopping category was made clickable, which doesn't really count as a change to "the rules" since it didn't change the wording of the description at all. That's why I was wondering why ave13co brought it up.

ave13co · Apr 12, 2004

I stand corrected

motsa]And? The point I was making is that the [b]only[/b said:
change made to the description/submission guidelines since 2001 was that the link to the Shopping category was made clickable, which doesn't really count as a change to "the rules" since it didn't change the wording of the description at all. That's why I was wondering why ave13co brought it up.

I stand corrected. I had a cached copy of the rules and they are identical.Now for your statement..

"Just wanted to add a note: we list sites based on the content they have now, not content they might have in the future. Therefore, it's entirely likely that you have been or will be denied a listing because of the lack of actual auctions on the site (I see only 21, all from the same person)."

Does that also mean that if a website that has no auction and has no members in its forum or chat area's will also not be listed?

What about a website that does not register members or actual auctions.No members but they have documentation about something...Will they be denied inclusion??

ave13co

Alucard · Apr 12, 2004

Content is king - useful content, as determined by the reviewing editor. That comes in many forms, and some forms are more appropriate for some categories than others.

If a site purports to be a discussion forum, and it has no posts in it, or the most recent post was made in 1998, then it's not much of a discussion forum. If a site purporting to be a sales site doesn't sell anything, then it's not of any use to the surfer.

Coming up with hard-and-fast rules about what makes listable content is neither possible nor desirable - if you put up rules like that you are inviting people to find loopholes.

Hope this explains well enough.

xixtas01 · Apr 12, 2004

Also, bear in mind that both content and our guidelines change over time. If what you're getting to is that there are sites listed which do not conform to the standards stated here, that's not a surprise. Nearly every category could use improvement, and each of those is just one single interested editor away from being improved.

motsa · Apr 13, 2004

ave13co said:
Does that also mean that if a website that has no auction and has no members in its forum or chat area's will also not be listed?

What about a website that does not register members or actual auctions.No members but they have documentation about something...Will they be denied inclusion??

It all depends on the nature of the site. An auction site should have a decent number of current auctions. A message board should have a decent amount of messages. Sites for whom a message board or auction or chat is just a small part will likely not be judged by the contents of that part (e.g. a comprehensive site about the history of blue widgets that happens to contain, in addition to reams of information about blue widgets, a forum with 2 members and 5 posts isn't really going to be judged by the content of the forum; on the other hand, a site that is just a forum to discuss blue widgets *would* be judged by the level of activity in it).

ave13co · Apr 13, 2004

motsa said:
It all depends on the nature of the site. An auction site should have a decent number of current auctions. A message board should have a decent amount of messages. Sites for whom a message board or auction or chat is just a small part will likely not be judged by the contents of that part (e.g. a comprehensive site about the history of blue widgets that happens to contain, in addition to reams of information about blue widgets, a forum with 2 members and 5 posts isn't really going to be judged by the content of the forum; on the other hand, a site that is just a forum to discuss blue widgets *would* be judged by the level of activity in it).

So its kind of a chicken and egg thing.... You need members but you can get them because you cant get listed... But to get these members,you must be listed....

Alucard · Apr 13, 2004

Yes, there is a tendency for that.

But if we were to list every potential site, that was hoping to get content, and include every web site that is under construction, we would have a directory that was pretty much useless.

We really have to list based on current content and not future. Hope that makes sense.

wrathchild · Apr 13, 2004

There are other ways besides ODP to promote your website.

hutcheson · Apr 13, 2004

ave13co said:
So its kind of a chicken and egg thing.... You need members but you can get them because you cant get listed... But to get these members,you must be listed....

Look at it from the perspective of the potential members (that is, the only people whom WE serve). So long as there are other forums already up, running and active, surfers are better off being directed to them. From their point of view, you're not offering chicken salad -- and listing your site would be a true disservice to all.

And therefore from OUR point of view, this is much worse than a chicken and egg situation. You're trying to abuse us to raid someone else's henhouse. And we don't appreciate it.

ave13co · Apr 13, 2004

Niche Auction

hutcheson said:
Look at it from the perspective of the potential members (that is, the only people whom WE serve). So long as there are other forums already up, running and active, surfers are better off being directed to them. From their point of view, you're not offering chicken salad -- and listing your site would be a true disservice to all.

And therefore from OUR point of view, this is much worse than a chicken and egg situation. You're trying to abuse us to raid someone else's henhouse. And we don't appreciate it.

I disagree, I am not "Abusing" anyone. Mine is a niche auction and there is only one other auction like it. You mean to tell me that by putting up a competing auctionsite is "Abusing" the public and not giving them a choice?
And it is not taking the monopoly away from the other site??

ODP Policy

ave13co

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xixtas01

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bobrat

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ave13co

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motsa

bobrat

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motsa

ave13co

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motsa

giz

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motsa

ave13co

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Alucard

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xixtas01

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motsa

ave13co

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Alucard

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wrathchild

hutcheson

ave13co

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