ODP Policy

spectregunner

Member
Joined
Jan 23, 2003
Messages
8,768
No, what we are all trying to tell you is that once your site has more content, we will reconsider it.

and it is not a binary chicken and egg scenario because you have lots and lots of other options for promoting and building your site. If ODP were the only directory of the web, then you would have a valid argument, but since we are but one of many, you should lower your shields, and listen to the good advice that you are being given, namely: go promote your site, gets lots of auctions and then come back and seek a listing (and the next guy will moan and complain that you are listed with your hundreds of auctions and he is not and how will he ever gat past the magic number of 3 unless he too is listed?)
 

hutcheson

Curlie Meta
Joined
Mar 23, 2002
Messages
19,136
We define how we are used and abused. And what you are doing is abuse, specifically forbidden by our submittal policy.

You may break any monopoly you want. Right now what the other site has, is a monopoly on content. We didn't make it, WE won't break it, we merely recognize that fact and go on.

We may wonder whether information is best kept on one site or spread out over two. Different editors may even have different opinions. And if an editor has a strong enough opinion, he may start a competing site -- it has happened once or twice. (This site itself is considered by some to be one such. I don't think it exactly competes with anyone, and THAT is perhaps the most important point. To get around a chicken/egg problem, you probably need to start with our own chicken coop -- SOMETHING that is unique that the other site CANNOT offer. It could be captive content; it could be more generous guidelines, or a slightly different focus with a natural membership that you could attract some other way.)

But when we list sites, we simply list what is there, and do not list what is not yet there.
 

ave13co

Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2004
Messages
18
Please explain

hutcheson said:
We define how we are used and abused. And what you are doing is abuse, specifically forbidden by our submittal policy.

You may break any monopoly you want. Right now what the other site has, is a monopoly on content. We didn't make it, WE won't break it, we merely recognize that fact and go on.

We may wonder whether information is best kept on one site or spread out over two. Different editors may even have different opinions. And if an editor has a strong enough opinion, he may start a competing site -- it has happened once or twice. (This site itself is considered by some to be one such. I don't think it exactly competes with anyone, and THAT is perhaps the most important point. To get around a chicken/egg problem, you probably need to start with our own chicken coop -- SOMETHING that is unique that the other site CANNOT offer. It could be captive content; it could be more generous guidelines, or a slightly different focus with a natural membership that you could attract some other way.)

But when we list sites, we simply list what is there, and do not list what is not yet there.




Please explain...

"And what you are doing is abuse, specifically forbidden by our submittal policy."
 

hutcheson

Curlie Meta
Joined
Mar 23, 2002
Messages
19,136
The bit about get the site finished before submitting, doesn't mean have the navigation bar working. It means having some content to navigate to. If the site is a forum, that means activity. If an auction, it means having enough items to auction that the surfer is likely to see something worth bidding on.

(It doesn't need to mean having all the world's content either: just enough content that it would be worthwhile for a surfer to go there.)

Most auction sites ... well, actually, 99.9% of them die unseen. Most successful forums start out as an adjunct to something else: a community; a vocal expert with an audience; a core resource of topical content, etc. The lack of such an "egg" pretty well guarantees that the forum will fail -- and is a signal that (even if there seems to be a little activity) the editor probably shouldn't list it.
 

ave13co

Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2004
Messages
18
hutcheson said:
The bit about get the site finished before submitting, doesn't mean have the navigation bar working. It means having some content to navigate to. If the site is a forum, that means activity. If an auction, it means having enough items to auction that the surfer is likely to see something worth bidding on.

(It doesn't need to mean having all the world's content either: just enough content that it would be worthwhile for a surfer to go there.)

Most auction sites ... well, actually, 99.9% of them die unseen. Most successful forums start out as an adjunct to something else: a community; a vocal expert with an audience; a core resource of topical content, etc. The lack of such an "egg" pretty well guarantees that the forum will fail -- and is a signal that (even if there seems to be a little activity) the editor probably shouldn't list it.

Thank you for your input and the spirited discussion. I now have more information to go with.I have been working on this site for almost 4 years since I am not a real programmer. I can honestly tell you that my site is not going away soon.
I will work on content and come back.
 

giz

Member
Joined
May 26, 2002
Messages
3,112
I am one of those people that wished there were less auction sites, not more. As a seller, faced with hundreds of sites to proffer my wares, I am highly confused. I usually just look on ebay for all. If I ever stray away from that, then I run across hundreds of other auctions but many of these are just front pages that lead back to ebay.

Even if I find a site that is notebay then I still have a dilemma. Bidding for an item both on ebay and on notebay, how am I to know that the items are not actually one and the same item from exactly the same one seller who is going to take the best auction and close off the lower bidding, less-popular ones, without a sale? If I bid in both, effectively I am bidding against myself. I am also spending twice the amount of time for just one result on one item.

As a seller, faced with multiple places to sell my wares, do I offer it for sale in just one place and hope it has the widest audience, or would I be tempted to offer it in several (to try to capture a wider audience) and then blow out the lower bidding auctions? Again, this is a waste of the sellers time too. He is advertising it twice, just to sell one item.




Compare this to a real world example. In the UK, a popular Sunday morning exploit is to visit "car-boot sales". As it says, this is an event held in a shop car park before opening time, or in a sports field, or a school playground, or somesuch place. People turn up with a car load of old stuff that they want to sell on, pay the organiser of the event a couple of quid for a "pitch", and then sell the stuff they brought along, out of the back of the car, or off a small table brought with them. Some people sell now and again just to offload some surplus stuff, while others make a "pocket money" business out of it selling stuff every week, sometimes at multiple events.

Round here, on a Sunday morning, there are two or three events separated by quite a few miles. However, a few years back, there were a lot more. In fact, at one time, there was a big event in the morning, and then a mile away, another one in the afternoon. Guess what? 75% of the sellers at the morning event, went on to the afternoon event; and 75% of the buyers that were at the afternoon event had come along having been to the morning event first. So, in the afternoon, as a buyer, you had the strange scenario that the vast majority of what you were now looking at, you had already seen just a few hours ago, just a mile down the road. For the afternoon sellers, it was equally frustrating: most of their potential customers having seen the stuff in the morning and not bought it, didn't buy it in the afternoon either.

So, although at first the numbers of both buyers and sellers at the afternoon event were quite high, this quickly trailed off as the buyers weren't buying, and the sellers weren't selling. The lack of new unique content on the tables, and new customers (compared to the morning) to sell to, meant that the afternoon event folded and closed after just a few months.

It wasn't that it was a poor event, but simply that having two sales on the same day in close proximity meant that the latter one was a waste of both the sellers time, and the buyers time.

Can you see why I feel the same way about having less, rather than more, auction sites too? It is the same sort of problem.
 

ave13co

Member
Joined
Apr 11, 2004
Messages
18
Free

giz said:
I am one of those people that wished there were less auction sites, not more. As a seller, faced with hundreds of sites to proffer my wares, I am highly confused. I usually just look on ebay for all. If I ever stray away from that, then I run across hundreds of other auctions but many of these are just front pages that lead back to ebay.

Even if I find a site that is notebay then I still have a dilemma. Bidding for an item both on ebay and on notebay, how am I to know that the items are not actually one and the same item from exactly the same one seller who is going to take the best auction and close off the lower bidding, less-popular ones, without a sale? If I bid in both, effectively I am bidding against myself. I am also spending twice the amount of time for just one result on one item.

As a seller, faced with multiple places to sell my wares, do I offer it for sale in just one place and hope it has the widest audience, or would I be tempted to offer it in several (to try to capture a wider audience) and then blow out the lower bidding auctions? Again, this is a waste of the sellers time too. He is advertising it twice, just to sell one item.




Compare this to a real world example. In the UK, a popular Sunday morning exploit is to visit "car-boot sales". As it says, this is an event held in a shop car park before opening time, or in a sports field, or a school playground, or somesuch place. People turn up with a car load of old stuff that they want to sell on, pay the organiser of the event a couple of quid for a "pitch", and then sell the stuff they brought along, out of the back of the car, or off a small table brought with them. Some people sell now and again just to offload some surplus stuff, while others make a "pocket money" business out of it selling stuff every week, sometimes at multiple events.

Round here, on a Sunday morning, there are two or three events separated by quite a few miles. However, a few years back, there were a lot more. In fact, at one time, there was a big event in the morning, and then a mile away, another one in the afternoon. Guess what? 75% of the sellers at the morning event, went on to the afternoon event; and 75% of the buyers that were at the afternoon event had come along having been to the morning event first. So, in the afternoon, as a buyer, you had the strange scenario that the vast majority of what you were now looking at, you had already seen just a few hours ago, just a mile down the road. For the afternoon sellers, it was equally frustrating: most of their potential customers having seen the stuff in the morning and not bought it, didn't buy it in the afternoon either.

So, although at first the numbers of both buyers and sellers at the afternoon event were quite high, this quickly trailed off as the buyers weren't buying, and the sellers weren't selling. The lack of new unique content on the tables, and new customers (compared to the morning) to sell to, meant that the afternoon event folded and closed after just a few months.

It wasn't that it was a poor event, but simply that having two sales on the same day in close proximity meant that the latter one was a waste of both the sellers time, and the buyers time.

Can you see why I feel the same way about having less, rather than more, auction sites too? It is the same sort of problem.



The reason I started to build this site is because of the $100-$200 per month that I have to pay ebay(still selling).
My auctionsite is FREE TO ALL.
That should be plenty of incentive to any seller.I know there are many auctions. There are many Everysoft auctions(GPL). But there are few Everysoft auctions developed enough to actually call itself an auction. Do a search and you will see. Very few. Also like I said before, there is only one other auction in my "niche". I think the people will be happy to have a choice once they know the site is there..
 
This site has been archived and is no longer accepting new content.
Top