2 Years Later, Site Not Listed!

I think that the idea of DMOZ is good, but the realization could be better.

I don't like tha fact that website owners can't ask about the status of their site anymore, it could help them a lot. I often see a situation where quality sites are ignored by DMOZ editors for years. Sometimes the owners of these sites are more professional than DMOZ editors in this area, but they can't be an editors and list their own sites.

Is there lots of corruption in DMOZ? Yes, I personally think so. I've been heared lots of times when people say that their sites are deleted from DMOZ. These sites are sometimes of very high quality and I can't even imagine the reason why these sites could be deleted.

I'm almost sure that nobody will listen to my opinion here, I've just found this thread and decided to tell what I think. I hope I'm entitled to say it, I've been working in internet business for 7 years already, 14-16 hours each day for the last 3 years and I have some knoledge and experience about it.

I don't want to say that all of DMOZ reviewers are bad. Some of them are great people who really try to help DMOZ to be a good directory. But DMOZ is dyeing and unfortunately these great people can't stop this process. DMOZ will be completely dead in the future if nobody change it's politics.

I don't like tha fact that website owners can't ask about the status of their site anymore, it could help them a lot.

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We know from experience that it wouldn't help most people even a little bit. We know this. It's been tried and proven.

I often see a situation where quality sites are ignored by DMOZ editors for years.

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It is unlikely to be the sites as such that are "ignored". Probably they belong in categories where there isn't much editor interest. And in any case, if "a quality site is ignored", that situation wouldn't change by its owner being allowed to ask for site status here - we'd never list sites only because their owners posted at Resource-Zone.

Sometimes the owners of these sites are more professional than DMOZ editors in this area, but they can't be an editors and list their own sites.

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Many editors own websites. Of course we can't accept people as editors who are only interested in listing their own site(s). If somebody is interested in finding, reviewing and listing sites in a category where they themselves own a site, they can become editors - as evinced by the fact that many such people are accepted every week.

Is there lots of corruption in DMOZ? Yes, I personally think so.

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You are entitled to your beliefs, but you will forgive us if we don't act on it until you have given us some kind of evidence.

I've been heared lots of times when people say that their sites are deleted from DMOZ. These sites are sometimes of very high quality and I can't even imagine the reason why these sites could be deleted.

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Please give us details of these sites. (Not in this forum, please. Use the abuse report form and provide URLs of sites that are listable according to the ODP guidelines, which used to be listable but have been removed.) Again, rumour is only rumour and you can't expect editors to act on vague second-hand information without any kind of pointer as to where to look.

I'm almost sure that nobody will listen to my opinion here, I've just found this thread and decided to tell what I think. I hope I'm entitled to say it, I've been working in internet business for 7 years already, 14-16 hours each day for the last 3 years and I have some knoledge and experience about it.

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As long as you express your opinion civilly - as you did - you are certainly allowed to do so. Hopefully you will also listen to and try to understand the responses. The biggest problem with Internet communication is that people don't take the time to understand what is being communicated to them. (That's because we are not yet used to this mode of communication. Maybe in a couple of generations, if humankind is still around.)

We know from experience that it wouldn't help most people even a little bit. We know this. It's been tried and proven.

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Let's ask webmasters on some big webmaster forums. I think that the most part of them will not agree with you. Or their opinion isn't impoartant?

Also I want to add about DMOZ support system: when people write something to DMOZ they can't even know if their message is unread or unanswered. It's like trhowing a bottles with letters in a sea - the same result. Sometimes the answer can't be delivered to them because of email spam filters, even if the answer exists. I would better PM somebody here. I would know at least that my question is delivered and read and that the answer will be delivered to me too.

I will write here more when DMOZ will be available again, right now it's down

I will write here more when DMOZ will be available again, right now it's down

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It's a little sporadic getting into, but it's not down once you get in, I just did a bunch of reconstruction work on a category this morning, before I popped in here.

Let's ask webmasters on some big webmaster forums. I think that the most part of them will not agree with you. Or their opinion isn't impoartant?

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Actually, we're aware of their opinions, and no it wouldn't be important to us, I think, because their purposes are self serving and not for the benefit of the Directory but for themselves. We don't serve website owners/builders/seos, but web surfers looking for information.

So, you're trying to get sites listed (and that's all that's important to you), but we judge whether a site will benefit a web surfer, or whether it will add value to the category. If it doesn't we don't want it.

Also I want to add about DMOZ support system: when people write something to DMOZ they can't even know if their message is unread or unanswered. It's like trhowing a bottles with letters in a sea - the same result. Sometimes the answer can't be delivered to them because of email spam filters, even if the answer exists. I would better PM somebody here. I would know at least that my question is delivered and read and that the answer will be delivered to me too.

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You're welcome to post here in public, and we'll try to respond to you, but because of past threats towards editors and their families, we encourage editors not to respond to submitters. Some do, and some don't.

If it's a polite enquiry, I will always have the courtesy to respond to someone, but, I have a lot of experience and even then, sometimes I'm sorry I bothered, .

I mean look at the attitude you walked in here with. You're visiting webmaster forums and listening to people who have been banned from the Directory for abuse, or who are bitter that there's no system they can work for their own benefit, and you're taking what they say as absolute truth, instead of finding out the truth from us.

Actually, we're aware of their opinions, and no it wouldn't be important to us, I think, because their purposes are self serving and not for the benefit of the Directory but for themselves. We don't serve website owners/builders/seos, but web surfers looking for information.

So, you're trying to get sites listed (and that's all that's important to you), but we judge whether a site will benefit a web surfer, or whether it will add value to the category. If it doesn't we don't want it.

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If these webmasters have quality sites - then it's benefit for the directory too.

I want to add that the structure of some DMOZ categories could be improved. I mean it could be more imformative for surfers.

Also alphabetical order of sites is important only for people who're searching for some specific name of site. But actually the order by popularity is better.

The quality of a site suggestion by the owner/webmaster/seo is probably judged much differently, than the way we look at it. The creator looks at it from their perspective, whereas we look at it from the information seeker perspective.

Most times, though, there might be nothing wrong with a site suggestion at all, and site owners are seeing ghosts where there are none, it just hasn't been reviewed yet, .

I want to add that the structure of some DMOZ categories could be improved. I mean it could be more imformative for surfers.

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You're absolutely right, and that's one of the many other jobs we do in the Directory. In fact, that's exactly what I've been doing this morning, .

Also alphabetical order of sites is important only for people who're searching for some specific name of site. But actually the order by popularity is better.

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The Directory isn't a search engine, and we don't rank sites, we collect and organize data for others to use (and many times they do just what you've suggested with the data).

I would say that none of us are really all that happy with our search feature, but, I believe it's intended more as a category search tool, than a full fledged search engine, . To search for a site, leave the www. off the url. Just use mysite.com.

The quality of a site suggestion by the owner/webmaster/seo is probably judged much differently, than the way we look at it. The creator looks at it from their perspective, whereas we look at it from the information seeker perspective.

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Some of these owners are very professional in their categories. Their opinion should be important too for DMOZ editors because it's important for surfers. Some of these owners are even could be an editors in their categories.

I know that some of these people would use their position only for their profit, and it's very difficult to control them. Probably this is the main reason why it's so difficult to become a DMOZ editor even if you're a real pro in your area.

I know that in my business reputation means everything. Reliable persons, known by everybody, will never do anything bad because they don't want to lose their reputation and also they've proved themselves as a good people already. Probably this idea can be used in DMOZ too, that's why it's better to let webmasters ask about their status.

Some of these owners are very professional in their categories. Their opinion should be important too for DMOZ editors because it's important for surfers. Some of these owners are even could be an editors in their categories.

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Many of them are already editors, including a few SEOs, . Most editors have sites of their own, some are webmasters, some are comp tech guys, some (like myself) have no sites anymore, and wouldn't know one end of a comp from another..

An editor who is interested in fishing and knows something about the topic, or an editor who is familiar with a city and wants to edit there, become very valuable and capable editors in those areas because of their personal knowledge, as long as they are unbiased and treat every site equally.

Outside opinions by the public, I'm afraid, are very biased because they don't understand what it is we're doing. We are not a listing service for site owners, though we do list sites (so it's easy to get that impression), and most outsiders see us that way.

They feel we do a very poor job of servicing their personal needs and desires, and they are right, we don't. That's not what we're about. It isn't a consideration.

Webmasters and SEOs feel that because they are professionals in the industry, who create many of the sites, that they should be our partners and their voices and opinions should be taken into consideration, and we should allow them to tell us how to do our work. That's perfectly logical reasoning, except for one thing, we have a different goal than they do, and our focus is not on the supply end, but, on the end, where the users of the information (the web surfers) are.

I think editors are very aware of this difference, but, we've done a poor job of explaining it so the public understands it.

On the other hand, the good suggestions we hear from the public don't go unnoticed, we hear them, but, there is a big difference between having good ideas, and actually having the resources to implement them, .

Webmasters and SEOs feel that because they are professionals in the industry, who create many of the sites, that they should be our partners and their voices and opinions should be taken into consideration, and we should allow them to tell us how to do our work. That's perfectly logical reasoning, except for one thing, we have a different goal than they do, and our focus is not on the supply end, but, on the end, where the users of the information (the web surfers) are.

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I know a lot of webmasters who do their work not only for money, but also because they love what they do. They love the idea that they can make something good for surfers.

that's why it's better to let webmasters ask about their status.

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"webmasters" is a very vague title, and they are not a group of people who´s opinion could be considered. ODP has its rules and modus operandi which is the result of almost 10 years of activity. While the editors listen to opinions and constantly consider improvements, the question of "status reports" is a non-issue. It serves no purpose and has been discussed enough, just search this Forum.

I know a lot of webmasters who do their work not only for money, but also because they love what they do. They love the idea that they can make something good for surfers.

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I agree wholeheartedly, and I think such persons might make good editors, .

All editors are here for one reason, to serve the Internet community of web surfers by giving of their free time in areas that they find interesting. I'm new to watergardening, which is a very small category, but I'd like to find sites for it that would help other people who are interested in doing it, so I edit there for them.

I edit everything within the United States because I love finding new sites for very small, unsophisticated towns and villages. I feel they need a champion working for them that will get them on the Internet map, where they can compete with other cities.

Those are the kind of selfless reasons that most editors become editors, it is a wonderful community of very nice people, and they become like family, .